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Subject:
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Too Complicated
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Posted By:
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shiraz
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Post Date:
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9/18/2003 1:56:24 PM
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I just started reading the book.
And there are several things that come to mind:
- the authors have taken a finished product and begun explaining the product by peeling away the layers one by one as best as they can (top down approach).
Such an approach is daunting because you have go through tons of details before you can ever get around to the meat of the learning.
I recommend that if there is a rewrite the authors ought to adopt a cyclical approach instead of waterfall methodolgy.
Let me elaborate on what I mean :
they should first get the minimal website up and running within the first chapter and then BUILD upon that website on successive chapters leading the reader through the evolution of the project and the additions and the incremental complexities. Then they ought to have various versions of the same application available.
I have spent more than three business days merely understanding the "Foundations" and Foundations of Navigation and Style and setting up the behemoth of the application (the strong name feature is still unimplemented since I am using 2003 Architect).
The application is not that complex but it is hierarchical and the hierarchy (abstracting of everything) is GREAT and awesome in the name of flexibility (I wish there were more books with such exemplary code) BUT the readers should be lead from the foundation to the most flexible version instead of being forced to peel this onion of a book.
This is just my 2 cents. Hope the authors find it useful.
Ciao.
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Reply By:
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shiraz
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Reply Date:
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9/19/2003 1:33:41 PM
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OK I am on chapter 4 and just noticing that some of my suggestions are being followed here on chapter 4 (that is incremental addition of code ) and building up the website one component at a time.
But all the abstracted layers like the dbobject etc. and the business class was really unnecessary to explain earlier (and ought to be explained and added and the classes abstracted later on) in my opinion.
Currently as it stands I have to figure out the structure by drawing my own class diagrams control flow stuff.
I am trying to see how the mailnig list was implemented but it seems I have to wade through 4 chapters before I can get to the mailing lists section... oye vey
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Reply By:
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shiraz
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Reply Date:
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9/19/2003 6:24:59 PM
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A question occured to me , how are they communicating with the DB layer ? In particular where and how do they set the connection string and where do they call the procedures. I am on chapter 5 reading about serialization and deserialization.
Gentlemen the reason why most people avoid j2ee is due to its complexity. Congratulations on presenting me with an example of why people should avoid .net because its more complex at times than your average j2ee app. !
The trouble is that you can lose count of the class interaction unless there is an overview or class diagram!
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Reply By:
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drfunkie
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Reply Date:
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9/23/2003 10:06:42 PM
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This book is not for beginners. What version of the book do you have. I have the C# version.
The inside cover of this book lists the prerequisites.
Quoting about 10 lines down from the top:
"To get the most from this book you should:
1. Have a working knowledge of C# and ASP.net
2. Have some experience with visual Studio.Net and Visual C# standard 2002."
I'm sure the VB version of the book states the same.
Your failure to grasp the materials in this book is not a reflection of the programming languages used or their usage.
The I suggest that you start with Beginning ASP.net, Beginning vb.net/C#.
I also made the mistake of jumping right into this book before fully understanding the ASP.net framework.
I don't agree with some of the methodologies the authors employed. However as a developer I learned that there is more then one way to skin a wabbit. 
OK.
Here are some very good books to start.
Professional ASP.net (WROX)
Beginning ASP.net (WROX)
ASP.net Unleashed (SAMS)
Also, go to www.asp.net and read the forum posts by subject, example apps for beginners and just hang out with the Microsoft.Net GuRus.
There is more then enough help online to assist you into becoming a Microsoft.net gUrU to.
I also rate this book as outstanding.
 although I didn't 9 months and 3 books ago (hee hee)
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