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access thread: Access 2002 on XP
Message #1 by "Ajay Jain" <ajay_ndel@y...> on Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:08:17
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Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an Access
database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What would we
need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an option?
Message #2 by "Haslett, Andrew" <andrew.haslett@i...> on Fri, 25 Jan 2002 08:53:50 +1030
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Alan,
I haven't used 2002, but I haven't read or heard of any changes in this
respect. How many 'concurrent' users are you expecting - i.e. to actually
access the database at the same time.
Generally, opinions range from 5-20, but with careful coding you may be able
to handle more.
It all depends on the type of access also. Will it just be reading the data
for output, or making changes to the underlying data?
In terms of what you need:
1) a web server to host your database (allowing database access), and files.
2) code to interact with your database (eg ASP, ColdFusion, PHP. I Haven't
heard of 'Broadvision')
3) the database itself.
That's about it.
HTH
/Andrew
-----Original Message-----
From: Ajay Jain [mailto:ajay_ndel@y...]
Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 2:38 AM
To: Access
Subject: [access] Access 2002 on XP
Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an Access
database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What would we
need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an option?
Message #3 by "Paul McLaren" <paulmcl@t...> on Thu, 24 Jan 2002 22:30:57 -0000
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If you check Access help on 'specification' it gives the following (this
is from Access XP), although it doesn't seem to have changed from
97/2000 spec.
It gives the attribute and the maximum allowed:
Microsoft Access database (.mdb) file size 2 gigabytes minus the space
needed for system objects.
Number of objects in a database 32,768
Modules (including forms and reports with the HasModule property set to
True) 1,000
Number of characters in an object name 64
Number of characters in a password 14
Number of characters in a user name or group name 20
Number of concurrent users 255
255 is the answer you want for concurrent users.
Regards
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: Haslett, Andrew [mailto:andrew.haslett@i...]
Sent: 24 January 2002 22:24
To: Access
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
Alan,
I haven't used 2002, but I haven't read or heard of any changes in this
respect. How many 'concurrent' users are you expecting - i.e. to
actually access the database at the same time.
Generally, opinions range from 5-20, but with careful coding you may be
able to handle more.
It all depends on the type of access also. Will it just be reading the
data for output, or making changes to the underlying data?
In terms of what you need:
1) a web server to host your database (allowing database access), and
files.
2) code to interact with your database (eg ASP, ColdFusion, PHP. I
Haven't heard of 'Broadvision')
3) the database itself.
That's about it.
HTH
/Andrew
-----Original Message-----
From: Ajay Jain [mailto:ajay_ndel@y...]
Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 2:38 AM
To: Access
Subject: [access] Access 2002 on XP
Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an
Access
database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What would we
need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an option?
Message #4 by "Haslett, Andrew" <andrew.haslett@i...> on Fri, 25 Jan 2002 09:13:43 +1030
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hmm, I think their definition of 'concurrent' is different to mine.
In my experience, and that of numerous other's I've read, any more than a
handful of users accessing the database at the same time (ie. read / write
at almost exactly same time) then it struggles.
I may be wrong but if 255 users tried to actually 'access' the db at the
same time then I would have thought that 'sh*t would hit the fan'
Dunno, trial and error I guess.
/Andrew
-----Original Message-----
From: Paul McLaren [mailto:paulmcl@t...]
Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 9:01 AM
To: Access
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
If you check Access help on 'specification' it gives the following (this
is from Access XP), although it doesn't seem to have changed from
97/2000 spec.
It gives the attribute and the maximum allowed:
Microsoft Access database (.mdb) file size 2 gigabytes minus the space
needed for system objects.
Number of objects in a database 32,768
Modules (including forms and reports with the HasModule property set to
True) 1,000
Number of characters in an object name 64
Number of characters in a password 14
Number of characters in a user name or group name 20
Number of concurrent users 255
255 is the answer you want for concurrent users.
Regards
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: Haslett, Andrew [mailto:andrew.haslett@i...]
Sent: 24 January 2002 22:24
To: Access
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
Alan,
I haven't used 2002, but I haven't read or heard of any changes in this
respect. How many 'concurrent' users are you expecting - i.e. to
actually access the database at the same time.
Generally, opinions range from 5-20, but with careful coding you may be
able to handle more.
It all depends on the type of access also. Will it just be reading the
data for output, or making changes to the underlying data?
In terms of what you need:
1) a web server to host your database (allowing database access), and
files.
2) code to interact with your database (eg ASP, ColdFusion, PHP. I
Haven't heard of 'Broadvision')
3) the database itself.
That's about it.
HTH
/Andrew
-----Original Message-----
From: Ajay Jain [mailto:ajay_ndel@y...]
Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 2:38 AM
To: Access
Subject: [access] Access 2002 on XP
Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an
Access
database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What would we
need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an option?
Message #5 by "David Adams" <davidadams00@h...> on Fri, 25 Jan 2002 08:51:40 -0500
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A problem that many people develop as the concurrent users increases deals
with the first requirement (2GB space). In a data-aware app using Access as
the database, Access is very poor at keeping itself in-sync and optimized.
Any data updates tend to balloon the size of the DB until a Repair & Compact
is run. Your problem comes that as concurrency increases, it becomes that
much more difficult to Compact the DB since all Users must be out before it
can be done.
Performing the Compact in code is easy, but as concurrency increases the
basic requirement that only one User (the Compacting User) be connected
becomes more and more difficult. As the size increases past 2GB, the DB
usually begins to have intermittent, strange data issues.
Basically, you would want the DB to be compacted -more- as more concurrent
Users access it. Instead, because it more difficult to get the "lock" as
concurrency increases, you end up having it done -less-.
It is this reason that Access gets the reputation of a DB that does not
"scale" well.
Minimums/Maximums: I try to stay in a range of 10-25 (measuring the scale
understanding that if access is predominately read-only, then I can lean
toward the upper end and if access requires A/U/D/R, then I lean toward the
lower end).
David Adams
----- Original Message -----
From: "Haslett, Andrew" <andrew.haslett@i...>
To: "Access" <access@p...>
Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 5:43 PM
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
> hmm, I think their definition of 'concurrent' is different to mine.
>
> In my experience, and that of numerous other's I've read, any more than a
> handful of users accessing the database at the same time (ie. read / write
> at almost exactly same time) then it struggles.
>
> I may be wrong but if 255 users tried to actually 'access' the db at the
> same time then I would have thought that 'sh*t would hit the fan'
>
> Dunno, trial and error I guess.
>
> /Andrew
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul McLaren [mailto:paulmcl@t...]
> Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 9:01 AM
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> If you check Access help on 'specification' it gives the following (this
> is from Access XP), although it doesn't seem to have changed from
> 97/2000 spec.
>
> It gives the attribute and the maximum allowed:
>
>
> Microsoft Access database (.mdb) file size 2 gigabytes minus the space
> needed for system objects.
> Number of objects in a database 32,768
> Modules (including forms and reports with the HasModule property set to
> True) 1,000
> Number of characters in an object name 64
> Number of characters in a password 14
> Number of characters in a user name or group name 20
> Number of concurrent users 255
>
> 255 is the answer you want for concurrent users.
>
> Regards
>
> Paul
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Haslett, Andrew [mailto:andrew.haslett@i...]
> Sent: 24 January 2002 22:24
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> Alan,
>
> I haven't used 2002, but I haven't read or heard of any changes in this
> respect. How many 'concurrent' users are you expecting - i.e. to
> actually access the database at the same time.
>
> Generally, opinions range from 5-20, but with careful coding you may be
> able to handle more.
>
> It all depends on the type of access also. Will it just be reading the
> data for output, or making changes to the underlying data?
>
> In terms of what you need:
> 1) a web server to host your database (allowing database access), and
> files.
> 2) code to interact with your database (eg ASP, ColdFusion, PHP. I
> Haven't heard of 'Broadvision')
> 3) the database itself.
>
> That's about it.
>
> HTH
>
> /Andrew
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ajay Jain [mailto:ajay_ndel@y...]
> Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 2:38 AM
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
> users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
>
> If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an
> Access
> database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What would we
> need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an option?
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message #6 by "Paul McLaren" <paulmcl@t...> on Fri, 25 Jan 2002 14:04:43 -0000
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David,
Fair analysis of Microsoft 'literal' facts, what I missed when quoting
the Microsoft stats was that for 255 users - I wouldn't personally like
to be the one supporting the database!
I have maintained a 100 user access database split front end / back end
where users added in the region of 30 records a day and it never peaked
above 300 meg, some thought had to be given to coding to avoid the
ballooning effect.
Compacting the database was done every couple of weeks, I know there are
third party programs for 'disconnecting' users but I always used NT
Server Manager to disconnect users that failed to observe the
maintainence periods and it solved the problem - I know this is not a
gospel practice and I reckon I was lucky it worked for me in this
situation.
Regards
Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: David Adams [mailto:davidadams00@h...]
Sent: 25 January 2002 13:52
To: Access
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
A problem that many people develop as the concurrent users increases
deals with the first requirement (2GB space). In a data-aware app using
Access as the database, Access is very poor at keeping itself in-sync
and optimized. Any data updates tend to balloon the size of the DB until
a Repair & Compact is run. Your problem comes that as concurrency
increases, it becomes that much more difficult to Compact the DB since
all Users must be out before it can be done.
Performing the Compact in code is easy, but as concurrency increases the
basic requirement that only one User (the Compacting User) be connected
becomes more and more difficult. As the size increases past 2GB, the DB
usually begins to have intermittent, strange data issues.
Basically, you would want the DB to be compacted -more- as more
concurrent Users access it. Instead, because it more difficult to get
the "lock" as concurrency increases, you end up having it done -less-.
It is this reason that Access gets the reputation of a DB that does not
"scale" well.
Minimums/Maximums: I try to stay in a range of 10-25 (measuring the
scale understanding that if access is predominately read-only, then I
can lean toward the upper end and if access requires A/U/D/R, then I
lean toward the lower end).
David Adams
----- Original Message -----
From: "Haslett, Andrew" <andrew.haslett@i...>
To: "Access" <access@p...>
Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 5:43 PM
Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
> hmm, I think their definition of 'concurrent' is different to mine.
>
> In my experience, and that of numerous other's I've read, any more
> than a handful of users accessing the database at the same time (ie.
> read / write at almost exactly same time) then it struggles.
>
> I may be wrong but if 255 users tried to actually 'access' the db at
> the same time then I would have thought that 'sh*t would hit the fan'
>
> Dunno, trial and error I guess.
>
> /Andrew
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul McLaren [mailto:paulmcl@t...]
> Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 9:01 AM
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> If you check Access help on 'specification' it gives the following
> (this is from Access XP), although it doesn't seem to have changed
> from 97/2000 spec.
>
> It gives the attribute and the maximum allowed:
>
>
> Microsoft Access database (.mdb) file size 2 gigabytes minus the space
> needed for system objects. Number of objects in a database 32,768
> Modules (including forms and reports with the HasModule property set
to
> True) 1,000
> Number of characters in an object name 64
> Number of characters in a password 14
> Number of characters in a user name or group name 20
> Number of concurrent users 255
>
> 255 is the answer you want for concurrent users.
>
> Regards
>
> Paul
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Haslett, Andrew [mailto:andrew.haslett@i...]
> Sent: 24 January 2002 22:24
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] RE: Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> Alan,
>
> I haven't used 2002, but I haven't read or heard of any changes in
> this respect. How many 'concurrent' users are you expecting - i.e. to
> actually access the database at the same time.
>
> Generally, opinions range from 5-20, but with careful coding you may
> be able to handle more.
>
> It all depends on the type of access also. Will it just be reading the
> data for output, or making changes to the underlying data?
>
> In terms of what you need:
> 1) a web server to host your database (allowing database access), and
> files.
> 2) code to interact with your database (eg ASP, ColdFusion, PHP. I
> Haven't heard of 'Broadvision')
> 3) the database itself.
>
> That's about it.
>
> HTH
>
> /Andrew
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ajay Jain [mailto:ajay_ndel@y...]
> Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 2:38 AM
> To: Access
> Subject: [access] Access 2002 on XP
>
>
> Has MS changed anything in the XP version to allow for more concurrent
> users? If Yes, How many concurrent users can we have?
>
> If we were to put a web front end (ASP, HTML, or Broadvision) on an
> Access database with a couple of hundred users, would that work? What
> would we need? Would the replication capabilities of Access be an
> option?
> ---
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