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asp_web_howto thread: Type of Data base
Message #1 by =?iso-8859-1?q?sunil=20mathur?= <sunilmathur7@y...> on Mon, 18 Dec 2000 22:37:03 -0800 (PST)
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I am working on a web portal for online perisable
products for the distributer and suppliers.
At this stage I do not know the traffic.
what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
Thanks for the advice
Sunil
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Message #2 by Scott Watermasysk <swatermasysk@C...> on Tue, 19 Dec 2000 08:25:16 -0500
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It will really depend on your number of users.
Access only supports about 30 concurrent users.
-Scott
-----Original Message-----
From: sunil mathur [mailto:sunilmathur7@y...]
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 1:37 AM
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
I am working on a web portal for online perisable
products for the distributer and suppliers.
At this stage I do not know the traffic.
what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
Thanks for the advice
Sunil
---
---
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Message #3 by "Drew, Ron" <RDrew@B...> on Tue, 19 Dec 2000 08:50:54 -0500
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I would not do that. I started with Access on a Sales DB and later had to
move to SQL 7.0 based on growth and it was extremely difficult. Sql 7.0 is
easier to work with using enterprise manager.
Ron
-----Original Message-----
From: sunil mathur [mailto:sunilmathur7@y...]
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 1:37 AM
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
I am working on a web portal for online perisable
products for the distributer and suppliers.
At this stage I do not know the traffic.
what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
Thanks for the advice
Sunil
---
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Message #4 by "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 10:40:32 +1100
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If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
later.
Cheers
Ken
----- Original Message -----
From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
> I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> products for the distributer and suppliers.
>
> At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> Thanks for the advice
> Sunil
---
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Message #5 by "ramliabdel" <ramliabdel@y...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 12:13:01 +0100
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Hi everyone,
I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm sure
I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work in
SQL straight away.
At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into the Access tables which
we want to use and make available on the web.
How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the layout the same ?.
Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may start with SQL ?
a----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
> with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
> later.
>
> Cheers
> Ken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
>
>
> > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> >
> > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > Thanks for the advice
> > Sunil
>
>
> ---
---
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Message #6 by "Unterste, Andreas" <unterste@d...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 06:28:25 -0500
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well..it's as simple as that and also not.
First important distinction, ACCESS is a desktop database and has both a
user interface to input, query data and the actual 'database engine' which
performs indexing, searching etc. SQL Server is only the database engine.
For sql - and I agree with the others, any half serious web site should go
against a SQL server - you'd need to understand the administration of a
database server. sql 7.0 helps a lot with the enterprise manager, which is
quite intuitive and let's you do most things with a few clicks. You will
also be able to create tables (incl. views, stored procedure etc.) from
there.
When it comes to handling data, you need different tools on top, one
possibility would be to 'link' the access tables into an access database to
input data, run basic verification queries etc. Accessing the data in your
Web App from ASP would then happen with ADO in the same manner as an access
database (different data provider though) just faster and more reliable.
I'd definetly suggest to put the sql on a different box than the web server
- saves you lot's of time afterwords.
Hope that helps as a starter. For main course I suggest trial and error with
a SQL installation (you can do personal SQL on a Win98 machine).
Cheers,
Andreas
-----Original Message-----
From: ramliabdel [mailto:ramliabdel@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:13
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
Hi everyone,
I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm sure
I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work in
SQL straight away.
At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into the Access tables which
we want to use and make available on the web.
How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the layout the same ?.
Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may start with SQL ?
a----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
> with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
> later.
>
> Cheers
> Ken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
>
>
> > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> >
> > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > Thanks for the advice
> > Sunil
>
>
> ---
---
---
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Message #7 by Jeremy Kirkup <JeremyK@t...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:36:33 -0000
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If you are using ADO you should be OK as this makes development quite
transparent.
Should be as simple as using a different ADO connect string.
There is an upsizing wizard for JET to SQLServer which you might find
useful.
Its also possible to use access to cut and paste table contents between JET
and
a linked SQLServer database. Some columns are a bit different eg JET has
memo type
whereas SQLServer has text and byte but all opther types should map OK.
Stick to standard SQL and you should be OK.
-----Original Message-----
From: ramliabdel [mailto:ramliabdel@y...]
Sent: 20 December 2000 11:13
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
Hi everyone,
I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm sure
I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work in
SQL straight away.
At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into the Access tables which
we want to use and make available on the web.
How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the layout the same ?.
Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may start with SQL ?
a----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
> with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
> later.
>
> Cheers
> Ken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
>
>
> > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> >
> > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > Thanks for the advice
> > Sunil
>
>
> ---
---
MaximumASP offers enhanced hosting solutions on the Windows 2000 platform. Dedicated processor, RAM, and server resources provide
dedicated server performance at virtual server prices. Commercial components provided; custom components allowed.
---
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Message #8 by Ron Newsham <rnewsham@t...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 11:41:04 +0000
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>===== Original Message From "ramliabdel" <ramliabdel@y...> =====
>Hi everyone,
>
>I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm sure
>I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
>However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
>I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work in
>SQL straight away.
OK- it can be done :-)
It depends on the complexity of the database of course - a simple
"three-table" database will be fairly trivial to convert - do watch out for
changes of data types (books online has lots of information)
The *big* difference is how you translate queries - for example you cannot
*easily* create crosstab queries: you need to write stored procedures for each
cross-tab. On the other hand, you have more flexibility in ensuring that
business rules are implemented (e.g. using triggers).
One thing to watch - PLAN THE MIGRATION - you will probably have to make
significant code changes to your ASPs, although with careful thought you
should be able to minimise the work. And that means testing :-( Also you need
to transfer data from the retired Access database into the new live SQLServer
database.
-----------------------
---
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Message #9 by amir eshterayeh <eshterayeh@y...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 03:52:40 -0800 (PST)
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dear freind
sql server 7.0 is used in concurent access of more
than one user to DB specially in the Client/Server and
also in Web so if you want to develop a web site, i
think using sql server is a must and creating db and
tables and views (like query in Access) is very simple
and in a visual environment.
Althogh you can import access db to your sql server
later, i do not recomment that SQL server has books
online and also there are a lot about it in msdn2000.
hope this help amir eshterayeh computer web
developer
feel free to contact.
--- ramliabdel <ramliabdel@y...> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm in the same situation, starting a project with
> Access for which I'm sure
> I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
> However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never
> used SQL server before,
> I do not have a clue on where to start and what to
> do to do the same work in
> SQL straight away.
> At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into
> the Access tables which
> we want to use and make available on the web.
> How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the
> layout the same ?.
> Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may
> start with SQL ?
>
>
>
>
>
> a----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
>
>
> > If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at
> some later stage, start
> > with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and
> then port to SQL Server
> > later.
> >
> > Cheers
> > Ken
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> > To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> > Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
> >
> >
> > > I am working on a web portal for online
> perisable
> > > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> > >
> > > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > > what database should I use,will it be ok to
> start of
> > > with Access,and than change over to SQL if
> required.
> > > Thanks for the advice
> > > Sunil
---
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Message #10 by "Drew, Ron" <RDrew@B...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 08:16:40 -0500
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This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.
------_=_NextPart_001_01C06A87.172C43C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Sql is just as easy as Access. In fact from a front end user's view it is
transparent. There are a few ways to do it. Since I came from the ODBC
days, that is what I use with 100 users internally banging away with no
problems. I would recommend when you start sql to load the enterprise
manager function to your pc versus having to go to the server each time a
change is made. Also, if you plan to do any drill down reports, Crystal 8
works well with sql.
Good Luck,
Ron
-----Original Message-----
From: ramliabdel [mailto:ramliabdel@y...]
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 6:13 AM
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
Hi everyone,
I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm sure
I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work in
SQL straight away.
At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into the Access tables which
we want to use and make available on the web.
How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the layout the same ?.
Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may start with SQL ?
a----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
> with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
> later.
>
> Cheers
> Ken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
>
>
> > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> >
> > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > Thanks for the advice
> > Sunil
>
>
> ---
---
MaximumASP offers enhanced hosting solutions on the Windows 2000 platform. Dedicated processor, RAM, and server resources provide
dedicated server performance at virtual server prices. Commercial components provided; custom components allowed.
---
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Message #11 by "O'Hara, Elliott M" <EMOHARA@k...> on Wed, 20 Dec 2000 08:29:54 -0500
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HI all,
Same situation... We have a BIG Access database... and I used
Access' wizard to "upgrade" to SQL. Not a pretty picture at all. I HIGHLY
recommend Starting in SQL. Like everyone else has said. SQL isn't that big
of a beast. Definitely start with SQL and save yourself headaches.
Elliott
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Newsham [mailto:rnewsham@t...]
Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 6:41 AM
To: ASP Web HowTo
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
>===== Original Message From "ramliabdel" <ramliabdel@y...> =====
>Hi everyone,
>
>I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm
sure
>I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
>However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server before,
>I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work
in
>SQL straight away.
OK- it can be done :-)
It depends on the complexity of the database of course - a simple
"three-table" database will be fairly trivial to convert - do watch out for
changes of data types (books online has lots of information)
The *big* difference is how you translate queries - for example you cannot
*easily* create crosstab queries: you need to write stored procedures for
each
cross-tab. On the other hand, you have more flexibility in ensuring that
business rules are implemented (e.g. using triggers).
One thing to watch - PLAN THE MIGRATION - you will probably have to make
significant code changes to your ASPs, although with careful thought you
should be able to minimise the work. And that means testing :-( Also you
need
to transfer data from the retired Access database into the new live
SQLServer
database.
-----------------------
---
---
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dedicated server performance at virtual server prices. Commercial components provided; custom components allowed.
---
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Message #12 by "Asmadi Ahmad" <chloro@e...> on Thu, 21 Dec 2000 07:58:23 +0800
|
|
hi,
Interesting discussion topic.
The upsizing wizard, does it maintain all the data (auto increment
indexes,relationships and stored queries) when you upsize from JET to
SQLServer?
asmadi
www.effitech.com
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeremy Kirkup <JeremyK@t...>
To: ASP Web HowTo <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Wednesday, 20 December, 2000 7:36 PM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you are using ADO you should be OK as this makes development quite
> transparent.
> Should be as simple as using a different ADO connect string.
>
> There is an upsizing wizard for JET to SQLServer which you might find
> useful.
> Its also possible to use access to cut and paste table contents between
JET
> and
> a linked SQLServer database. Some columns are a bit different eg JET has
> memo type
> whereas SQLServer has text and byte but all opther types should map OK.
>
> Stick to standard SQL and you should be OK.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ramliabdel [mailto:ramliabdel@y...]
> Sent: 20 December 2000 11:13
> To: ASP Web HowTo
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
>
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm in the same situation, starting a project with Access for which I'm
sure
> I'll need to upgrade to SQL server later.
> However, as I'm familiar with Access and have never used SQL server
before,
> I do not have a clue on where to start and what to do to do the same work
in
> SQL straight away.
> At the moment we are entering (typing) the data into the Access tables
which
> we want to use and make available on the web.
> How and what is the equivalent stage in SQL, is the layout the same ?.
> Perhaps, if it is just as simple as Access, we may start with SQL ?
>
>
>
>
>
> a----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2000 12:40 AM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
>
>
> > If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage,
start
> > with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL
Server
> > later.
> >
> > Cheers
> > Ken
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> > To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> > Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
> >
> >
> > > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> > >
> > > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > > Thanks for the advice
> > > Sunil
---
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dedicated server performance at virtual server prices. Commercial components provided; custom components allowed.
---
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Message #13 by "Michael Goldman" <mg188@h...> on Fri, 22 Dec 2000 12:14:02 -0800
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|
I'm developing on my home pc but will use a webhost. Can I use Sql Server
Developer/Test Edition ($499) to not only develop on my home pc, but also
manage the db once I move it to a webhost? Will I need any other sw? Also,
I'm thinking of switching from win98 to win2k. Would win2k pro be
sufficient, or would I need win2k server?
Also, my db (in Access) and 38 webpages are almost finished. Are there any
good, inexpensive tools to help with converting both for Sql Server, or will
I just need to grunt it out?
Thanks in advance,
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...>
To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 3:40 PM
Subject: [asp_web_howto] Re: Type of Data base
> If you anticipate that you may need SQL Server at some later stage, start
> with SQL Server now. Do not start with Access and then port to SQL Server
> later.
>
> Cheers
> Ken
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "sunil mathur" <sunilmathur7@y...>
> To: "ASP Web HowTo" <asp_web_howto@p...>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 5:37 PM
> Subject: [asp_web_howto] Type of Data base
>
>
> > I am working on a web portal for online perisable
> > products for the distributer and suppliers.
> >
> > At this stage I do not know the traffic.
> > what database should I use,will it be ok to start of
> > with Access,and than change over to SQL if required.
> > Thanks for the advice
> > Sunil
>
>
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Message #14 by "Ken Schaefer" <ken@a...> on Sat, 23 Dec 2000 20:44:18 +1100
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> I'm developing on my home pc but will use a webhost. Can I use Sql Server
> Developer/Test Edition ($499) to not only develop on my home pc, but also
> manage the db once I move it to a webhost? Will I need any other sw?
FTP program (to get the DB files from your machine to the remote machine)
:-)
> Also,
> I'm thinking of switching from win98 to win2k. Would win2k pro be
> sufficient, or would I need win2k server?
Win2k Pro should be fine, unless you need the additional features that Win2k
Server provides. The SQL Server install for Win2k Pro is the same feature
set as with Win98.
> Also, my db (in Access) and 38 webpages are almost finished. Are there
any
> good, inexpensive tools to help with converting both for Sql Server, or
will
> I just need to grunt it out?
Depends on how you wrote your application in the first place. For example,
if you wrote a function to write in Date/Time delimiters, then you'd only
need to change the function, and all your SQL statements will start using '
instead of # for date delimiters. If you didn't encapsulate this in a
function, then you'll need to edit this on every page.
Also, you'll want to move as many of your SQL statements into the DB as
stored procedures to fully take advantage of SQL Server. This fact alone is
the main reason I'd recommend starting with SQL Server rather than trying to
upgrade later (if you envisage ever needing SQL Server)
Cheers
Ken
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