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Intro Programming What is a loop? Which language is best for beginners? What is "object oreinted?" All those types of questions and more are welcome here.
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old March 22nd, 2007, 12:47 PM
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Surely this concept is not news, but I repeat it so we keep it in mind: When the method of visual programming 1st came out (dragging objects onto a form and dropping them there), along with easy access to the event model, many thought that application creation would become so easy that managers would do their own, and programmers would be put out of work.

Of course, what happened was really horrid “Mr. Potato Head” programs were written on the one hand, but OTOH sophisticated programs could be written more easily when the programmers were freed from having to define a window frame, et al.

It is the same with anything. I am a professional-grade guitarist, and some people ask me to show them how to play guitar out of an egotistical desire to see themselves as a "guitarist," and some are actually intrigued by music.

I am a professional-level auto mechanic. Some people want me to fix their cars for free, some really want to know how the thing works.

It is the same with everything that I am good at. There are the pinnacles and the depths.

I think these fora are huge disseminators of knowledge to those capable of understanding, and Cliff’s Notes for others. I don't think this dual-mode result can be avoided.

     There was a doctor at a cocktail party, talking to a lawyer. He asked, "We are both professionals, so it must be the same for you as it is for me: how do you avoid people incessantly coming up to you trying to get free advice?"
     The lawyer answered, "Well, I just keep track of how long I spent giving the advice they asked for, then I send them a bill for my time."
     The doctor said, "Why, that’s brilliant! I’m going to have to start doing that myself!"
     A week later, the doctor got a bill from the lawyer for 10 minutes counsel . . .
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old April 7th, 2007, 07:24 PM
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On that note, this may be an example of what you mean, dparsons:
http://p2p.wrox.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=58223

Now I feel a bit responsible (although I know that I'm not the one who improperly taught him/her Java), but if I keep helping this one then I'll get frustrated and just give him the answer. What would any of you do in this case? Just walk away or finish what was started?

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Old April 8th, 2007, 10:45 AM
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Hmmm. I am going to use this post as a reference point:
http://p2p.wrox.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=56384

To date, it is the longest thread I have ever actively participated in (5 pages) and, outside of a few additional comments by other members, I assisted this individual from start to end. The difference between my thread and yours is that this person never said "can someone correct this so it will compile" or anything to that affect which is why I continued to help them. Granted I got a little bit frustrated but that was because, to me, what they were trying to do is rudimentary but to a beginner it can seem like the most complex thing in the world. Patience is a virture.

When someone posts a code segement and blatenly asks for someone to fix it, I will normally reply with something like "I am not here to do your work for you" or "Well, if you want to hire me to do work for you, ill be glad to fix your code". I just skimmed over the topic you posted but you seem to be going about it the right way: trying to make the OP think for themselves and that is as it should be.

In your case, 1 of 3 things is going to happen:
1. You are going to get overly frustrated with the person and abandon the thread.
2. You are going to try and help the person further, resulting in more frustration: GOTO 1.
3. You are going to tell the OP that, while you don't mind helping them solve a problem, you are not here to complete their work or think on their behalf. The OP will either begin to try and think more for themselves or they will repost the topic to try and get an answer.

Number 3 is more preferable, but how you handle it is entirely up to you. Personally I try to push OPs to get into the groove of reductive thinking, problem solving, researching, so on and so forth (e.g. getting them to act like a programmer).

I feel your pain though. ;]

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