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General .NET For general discussion of MICROSOFT .NET topics that don't fall within any of the other .NET forum subcategories or .NET language forums.  If your question is specific to a language (C# or Visual Basic) or type of application (Windows Forms or ASP.Net) try an applicable forum category. ** PLEASE BE SPECIFIC WITH YOUR QUESTION ** When posting here, provide details regarding the Microsoft .NET language you are using and/or what type of application (Windows/Web Forms, etc) you are working in, if applicable to the question. This will help others answer the question without having to ask.
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Old July 9th, 2004, 02:04 AM
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Default Any working C# professional????

Hello,

Is there anyone over here whos working as a C# software developer in some company.If so can you please answer my questions.I am a student and will be out searching for a job after an year.So please help

1.What topics in C# do we need to be good at?I mean in daily development what concepts you think are essential(apart from syntax)eg:Collections.Could you please list a few.
2.What kind of software do we actually need to design/code??I mean some specific software like some account management software or further complex?CAn you list one or two softwares you developed for your company as a part of your job?

Thanks guys in advance.This is just for educational purpose but not for some thing malign.
Bhargav
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Old July 9th, 2004, 08:15 AM
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A more important factor is that you should be familiar with the .NET class library. There are lots of classes in the framework (and an even more daunting number when 2.0 is released) but you can achieve a lot if you have a good idea of where to find what you need to use. Remember that C# is a .NET language, so understanding C# is one thing, understanding the framework is another. An expert VB6 developer would have no problem transitioning from VB6 to VB.NET from a language perspective, but that doesn't mean they will be able to do what they need/want to in .NET.

Work on familiarizing yourself with the framework classes. Or more importantly, the various namespaces of the framework. It's nearly impossible to know all the classes, but you can know the namespaces well enough to understand where you should look to find something. A lot will depend on the type of applications you will be building. I build primarily ASP.NET applications and would consider myself a bit of an expert within the realm of the System.Web namespace. However, when it comes to building desktop applications with windows forms, I can't even type off the top of head the namespace for them! I'm just a beginner with them.

A very important aspect to general .NET proficiency is to have a very good grasp of object oriented design. Many people who have been working with server-side web technologies (like ASP) have not had a language/technology that supports object oriented design. This can be a major hurdle in migrating to .NET. I was fortunate to have had an education that was rich in OO theory so when I finally got to build web sites using a technology that supported OO it was a natural and very welcome transition.

You are going to need to be familiar with all the basics of .NET programming: OOP topics, the event driven paradigm and of course all the basic stuff like the data types, collections, etc. A very important part of it all will be ADO.NET. Few real world programming tasks will not revolve around some form of data access. Be familiar with the System.Data namespace, XML, and the various data client namespaces (System.Data.SqlClient; System.Data.OleDb).

Also be prepared for things to be astronomically more complex than what you are used to. Educational settings allow for sample programs to be very simplistic. Once you have to write real applications things will be much more complex. You'll have to learn to deal with systems and code as they exist. I struggle a lot because there is always something that could be re-written better, but seldom do we have the opportunity to actually re-write. You will often need to deal with things as they are. Database structures can't be changed and legacy systems will always exist and remain.

The number one piece of advise I can give is to keep learning. Keep a large reference library, and use online tools as much as possible. I have found a lot by simply browsing the MSDN .NET documentation. Get familiar with the environment you will use to write your software so you can get as much out of it as possible. Teach yourself to work smarter so you don't have to work harder.
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Old July 9th, 2004, 12:33 PM
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HI planoie,
      Thanks for your valuable feedback.I am very happy to really know whats needed on the development phase.I am thankful to you.But the problem is as I read your reply i get more doubts :( You are an ASP.NET developer right?What do you think is the most essential thing in ASP.NET i.e; is it designing or cookies/sessions/caching/tracing ?????? I am a newbie as i told and just started working with ASP.NET.I want to learn something from a working professional perspective.Can you just list out what topics do you expect me to learn in ASP.NET so that i can be comfortable while working in a job?
Bhargav
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Old July 9th, 2004, 01:53 PM
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This is kind of a hard question to answer as the answer is dependent on the situation. You will certainly need to learn cookies, sessions and caching, because they are all necessary parts of building a web based application. You will need to understand how each is used so you can know whether or not you need to use them when you have to build an application.

If you are going to be working with ASP.NET I guess the most essential thing to understand is the nature of web based applications. It's vital to understand the statelessness of a web page and the functionality of postbacks and viewstate. When you understand these you'll be able to solve a lot of the problems that others encounter when building ASP.NET web applications. These are fundamentals of ASP.NET that must be understood to be a successful web application developer.

Surf around this forum and see the kinds of questions people ask and read the threads. It will give you a good idea about the things people struggle with and will hopefully also provide the answers and be of some value to you.

As I think more I am trying to imagine what my "punch list" of skills would be if I were to interview someone for a web developer position. One very important skill I would want someone to possess is the understanding of how and when to implement user/server controls. Understand how they are built, how you use them in a page, how to interact with them from the page and how to handle events to and from these controls.

As I continue to think about your question, I realize something important about myself and the way I think. I have found that in this industry it is more important that you know how to solve a problem then to know what tool you will use to solve it. After all, programming is problem solving. It is translating some task into logical sequences of steps and events. It doesn't matter if you know the exact syntax for this and that. What matters is that you evaluate and understand the problem then determine what the best solution is. You obviously must have a basic understanding of the tools you will use to implement the solution, but very often you'll need to look things up or ask someone to nail down syntax problems and things like that. But in the end the problem solving is the key. Sometimes, that is the hardest part to teach where a syntax is just another language.

I am reminded of an interview with the head of engineering/development of a company. We discussed briefly some technical things. I was basically a complete newbie. I had barely worked professionally with the technology that they used, and had never worked with the development environment that they used. Someone who was hiring based on a punch list of known skills would have turned me away before I even got to the door. But this guy is a real engineer type. So he asks me, "If we were to fill this room with ping-pong balls, how would you do it?" The question had absolutely nothing to do with a specific technology or language or anything like that. It was a question to test how I thought and solved the problem. I answered that question, and they made me an offer on the spot. You see, he recognized a similar mind and realized that I could learn a technology, teach myself the syntax and find whatever I needed to implement a solution. Those are just skills. The talent is finding the solution.

I'm sorry if this doesn't really answer your question. I feel like it's a hard question to answer. I mean, to be successful you'll need to know a large number of things. There is no one essential bit of knowledge.

But to rattle off the things that I know I have used and need to use regularly to build web applications...
- Postback behavior
- Viewstate
- HTML
- JavaScript
- Databases (SQL language, knowledge of specific RDBMS where appropriate)
- User controls
- Server controls
- OO topics (building classes; inheritance; overloading/polymorphism)
- Event handling (raising events, delegates)
- Cookies
- Sessions
- Caching
- XML
- Data binding

Hope this is of some help.
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Old July 9th, 2004, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
quote:If we were to fill this room with ping-pong balls, how would you do it?
And now the obvious question is of course: How *did* you do it? ;)

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Old July 9th, 2004, 09:00 PM
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Ah. See but if I gave away that answer, then I would be giving away the key to my success! ;)
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Old July 10th, 2004, 04:13 AM
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Ha, I guess that's the correct answer..... ;)

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Old July 10th, 2004, 04:30 AM
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Hi Planoie,
  Thanks for your valuable feedback.It was really good to listen to someone who saw the industry out there.Thank you very much.
Bhargav
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Old July 11th, 2004, 07:52 PM
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I hope my posts are useful.

I had another thought that might explain my long winded answers to a seemingly simple question. Someone told me once what an expert was. I always thought that an expert was someone who understood everything down to the tiny details of his/her subject. I think in some cases this is definately the case. However, in a field such as our's where our work scope takes us across many aspects of language, technology and the like, a true expert is someone who knows the basics of what they work with very well and knows how to find those tiny details so they can solve the problem. Without a solid understanding of the fundamentals, you cannot succeed. So like I said before, familiarize yourself with the fundamentals of as much as possible. Work on the basics. You'll be suprised what you can do with them.
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